AM back stiffness---help

Symptoms & Treatments
1

Hello to all my friends with fibro,

I am happy to report that Lyrica is working miracles with my burning muscle pains =:) That was very unbearable. I also purchased a book by Dr. Mark Pelligrino who has fibro himself. It is called"Fibromyalgia, Up Close and Personal" Many of u might have heard of it, but it is helping me greatly.

I am, however, having terrible stiffness of my back and neck in the am. I have tried cervical pillows, muscle relaxers, pain meds, different mattresses, baths with epson salts......the only thing that worked was high doses of baclofen; however the next day I was like a zombie!

Does anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks

Maria

2

The only thing that helps me is to start the day with stretches and light exercise. I have arthritis in my spine too - so I know how difficult this is. I do stretches before I get out of bed. Also - I'm not sure what kind of bed you're sleeping on. I can't sleep on a regular mattress - had to go to a memory foam bed. They are expensive but well worth it. I also got the adjustable mechanism (not tempurpedic but comparable) so I can sleep in a more comfortable position. I take xanaflex at night too. It's stronger than baclofen. Have you tried flexiril? Not quite as strong as baclofen.

3

I found out about something that made such sense. There are some pajamas, they are costly for sure but they have a material that stops ions from messing with you while you sleep. Even help with menopause I read. I think its called Goodnighties or something. Search Ion pajamas.

Now, I solved part of my problem with baby soft things. Nylon conducts electricity. Anything you wear with nylon on it, is going to cause you pain. All cotton, and baby soft, or at least thin flannel. If your skin is covered and nothing is sticking out while you sleep it does make a big difference.

We have a gene that keeps us from properly being in the hypnotic state as we sleep. I feel certain that its that condition that keeps us stiff when we wake. So far I can't find an answer to get around it, but I am searching daily. Some tips that have helped me are

Always wear something warm on your legs and feet. Do not eat any sugar products at all after dinner at night. Glucose does not metabolise when you don't get proper sleep. Stretch before you go to bed,and before you get up if you can do that before a trip to the bathroom. Don't allow A/c or fan to blow on you while you sleep, your nociceptors send bad vibes to the brain. Be sure you are taking a proper amount of Magnesium Malate - super important Fibro food. I take mine in the morning when I get up and about 9 at night... this helps me sleep better and wake up less tight.

Just some ideas. Its hard when you have to "tinkle" and can't move to get out of bed !

Hopabout

4

I have the same problem most days. I usually try to do some gentle stretches before I get out of bed, then head to a warm shower. It does seem to help loosen me up. If I still need a little something, I use Biofreeze spray to cool and ease some of the additional tension. I also use Robaxin instead of Baclofen or Flexeril as they both make me really drowsy. Hope this helps in some way.

5

Thank you Nancy for all the great advice. I was thinking about the matress. My neighboor has a sleep number bed and I might try that a few nights. I tried foam but i feel i need something more firm. I worked in medicine many years and the neurologist I worked with said baclofen was the most effective secondary to valium. I find flexeril, soma, Xanaflex to be ineffective. Baclofen works..but it causes too much fatigue.
Nancy M said:

The only thing that helps me is to start the day with stretches and light exercise. I have arthritis in my spine too - so I know how difficult this is. I do stretches before I get out of bed. Also - I'm not sure what kind of bed you're sleeping on. I can't sleep on a regular mattress - had to go to a memory foam bed. They are expensive but well worth it. I also got the adjustable mechanism (not tempurpedic but comparable) so I can sleep in a more comfortable position. I take xanaflex at night too. It's stronger than baclofen. Have you tried flexiril? Not quite as strong as baclofen.

6

Thank u Sarah. A hot bath does help

SarahW said:

I take Flexeril at night along with Klonopin, for anxiety, and do stretches in the morning. Sometimes I need a really hot shower in the morning too. And I do mean hot. As hot as I can stand it for about 3 minutes. I try to do some simple stretching while the water is running over me too. I hope you find something that helps!

7

Hi Hopabout,

Have you heard of the link between fibro and sleep apnea? I have severe sleep apnea and never reach REM sleep. So essentially all I get is nonrestorative sleep. I have a CPAP machine that I am attempting to get used to.

I will look for the pjs. I never heard of conductors of electricity causing pain. What is that connection?

AHHH the sugar thing. Now that is hard. I have been working on this for years and sometimes I am good and sometimes not so good. He He

Maria

Hopabout said:

I found out about something that made such sense. There are some pajamas, they are costly for sure but they have a material that stops ions from messing with you while you sleep. Even help with menopause I read. I think its called Goodnighties or something. Search Ion pajamas.

Now, I solved part of my problem with baby soft things. Nylon conducts electricity. Anything you wear with nylon on it, is going to cause you pain. All cotton, and baby soft, or at least thin flannel. If your skin is covered and nothing is sticking out while you sleep it does make a big difference.

We have a gene that keeps us from properly being in the hypnotic state as we sleep. I feel certain that its that condition that keeps us stiff when we wake. So far I can't find an answer to get around it, but I am searching daily. Some tips that have helped me are

Always wear something warm on your legs and feet. Do not eat any sugar products at all after dinner at night. Glucose does not metabolise when you don't get proper sleep. Stretch before you go to bed,and before you get up if you can do that before a trip to the bathroom. Don't allow A/c or fan to blow on you while you sleep, your nociceptors send bad vibes to the brain. Be sure you are taking a proper amount of Magnesium Malate - super important Fibro food. I take mine in the morning when I get up and about 9 at night... this helps me sleep better and wake up less tight.

Just some ideas. Its hard when you have to "tinkle" and can't move to get out of bed !

Hopabout

8

Thanks...i never tried Robaxin but do try and do stretches.

Maria

mdhwhite said:

I have the same problem most days. I usually try to do some gentle stretches before I get out of bed, then head to a warm shower. It does seem to help loosen me up. If I still need a little something, I use Biofreeze spray to cool and ease some of the additional tension. I also use Robaxin instead of Baclofen or Flexeril as they both make me really drowsy. Hope this helps in some way.

9

Hi again,

Since 9 in my family have Fibromyalgia and 3 ME/CFIDS I began studying genetics and the diseases all of my family members have 19 years ago. It became more than a hobby and it is seldom that I don't spend 3 hours each day diggin in some research Pdf or studying chemistry to connect all the molecules. It is nothing like what most people think it is.

The Robaxin is Guiafenisen derived and that truly helps many people. With some added muscular help it might be a key. Baclofen goes right to Gaba so it should be a good choice but if your gonna be a zombie all the time - you trade one problem for another right?

Scientist know now that Sleep Apnea is brain damage, not being chubby or having restricted airways from enlarged tonsils etc. That finding gave us a break. The Cpap helps many and can save your life but it caused me more problems and I had to stop using it. I hope it works for you.

The sugar, any excess salt, the Cpap and hey try pure gaba with all of that.

I managed to walk out of a wheelchair so getting the right combination can really make things different.

Good luck, hugs, Hopabout

fibrokitty said:

Hi Hopabout,

Have you heard of the link between fibro and sleep apnea? I have severe sleep apnea and never reach REM sleep. So essentially all I get is nonrestorative sleep. I have a CPAP machine that I am attempting to get used to.

I will look for the pjs. I never heard of conductors of electricity causing pain. What is that connection?

AHHH the sugar thing. Now that is hard. I have been working on this for years and sometimes I am good and sometimes not so good. He He

Maria

Hopabout said:

I found out about something that made such sense. There are some pajamas, they are costly for sure but they have a material that stops ions from messing with you while you sleep. Even help with menopause I read. I think its called Goodnighties or something. Search Ion pajamas.

Now, I solved part of my problem with baby soft things. Nylon conducts electricity. Anything you wear with nylon on it, is going to cause you pain. All cotton, and baby soft, or at least thin flannel. If your skin is covered and nothing is sticking out while you sleep it does make a big difference.

We have a gene that keeps us from properly being in the hypnotic state as we sleep. I feel certain that its that condition that keeps us stiff when we wake. So far I can't find an answer to get around it, but I am searching daily. Some tips that have helped me are

Always wear something warm on your legs and feet. Do not eat any sugar products at all after dinner at night. Glucose does not metabolise when you don't get proper sleep. Stretch before you go to bed,and before you get up if you can do that before a trip to the bathroom. Don't allow A/c or fan to blow on you while you sleep, your nociceptors send bad vibes to the brain. Be sure you are taking a proper amount of Magnesium Malate - super important Fibro food. I take mine in the morning when I get up and about 9 at night... this helps me sleep better and wake up less tight.

Just some ideas. Its hard when you have to "tinkle" and can't move to get out of bed !

Hopabout

10

Hi Fibrokitty,

I forgot to answer you regarding the electricity.

I just study. At this point after 19 years of it and 600 Fibromyalgia study subjects in the past years, I understand this stuff pretty good. I have some 20 boxes of files and two computers full. I only study research, not ideas on line.

I don't have medical training like you or understand the technical data - just read, absorb, cut and paste... and put it all together. Something I seldom see doctors doing. Your being in nursing is one of the first signs of Fibro. There is a list of professions and hobbies.

We are mostly made of water. We have a few electrolites wandering around inside of us - chloride being one that is essential to Fibros. But mostly we are a huge tall mound of atoms. Protons and Electrons. And, the foods we eat and amino acids we consume also have a plus and minus end just like a battery. The only problem is our amino acids are out of sinc - out of line in the chain - some are reversed, some are missing, and some are doubled instead of one unit as they should be. Virus, Toxins, Radiation, Bacteria... the list goes on as to what is responsible for that.

Ions in the air are interesting things. They are atoms or molecules where the electrons are not equal fo the number of protons. That gives the electrical positive or negative charge. + - An anion gives more electrons than protons and are negative. A cation gives fewer electrons than protons and are positive.

The more Negatively Charged Electric Ions there are in the blood, the more efficient the cell's metabolism process.

But, the more positive ions the slower and less efficient the cell's metabolism; we get sick and age faster.

Malls put waterfalls in them because the negative ions coming from the fall will make the shoppers happier. When we feel bad, a longer than usual warm shower will help because the water has negative ions.

I read that negative ions cut down the serotonin levels and act like a natural transquilizer. I am very much aware of the wind and electrical activity in the air before a storm because it affects my moods. When you are exposed to high levels of negative atmosphere, serotonin appears in the urine disposing the excess. Negative ions affect melatonin greatly, which is our sleep hormone and is also synthesized from serotonin. "Quality sleep can also help reduce the occurrence of common pains such as backache, and increase your resistance to illness. A study of negative ions are known to help people sleep better by regulating the production of chemicals in the brain."

Barometric pressure is an enemy to us because of the positive ions in the clouds whirling in the upper atmosphere and because of the pressure on the veins and tissues in our bodies. " Rheumatoid arthritis, osteoarthritis, low back pain, gout, fibromyalgia, phantom limb pain, scar pain, headaches, trigeminal neuralgia, and pain influenced by mood disorders are all affected heavily. . Weather is also associated with changes in birth rates, sperm count, outbreaks of pneumonia, influenza and bronchial problems."

The idea behind the pajamas is to give us negative ions... the feeling of good mood while we sleep. I heard about them first on the ProHealth Website. Then did more research.

The object is to keep the air around us negative not positive. Bacteria, mold, etc. love positive air in which they thrive. So the moral of the story is, if your really sick and feel bad, go to the mall or find a water fall !

Ok, I am wordy.... so much for Baro- Ion 101.

Hopabout

11

Hi Back,

Wow, your knowledge is impressive. Thank you for the info. Did not know Robaxin was guaifenisen derived but I have seen some Fibro clinics use a "Guaifenisen protecol". About the sleep apnea, i must say I never heard that it was brain damage but there is a "central" cause in the medical lit describing a problem with the brain. I wonder what my sleep doc would think! I will continue the cpap as I know I wake up many times short of breath. Still need to research the connection with fibro. I will ask my neurologist friend about Robaxin----

thanks for all the good information

Maria

Hopabout said:

Hi again,

Since 9 in my family have Fibromyalgia and 3 ME/CFIDS I began studying genetics and the diseases all of my family members have 19 years ago. It became more than a hobby and it is seldom that I don't spend 3 hours each day diggin in some research Pdf or studying chemistry to connect all the molecules. It is nothing like what most people think it is.

The Robaxin is Guiafenisen derived and that truly helps many people. With some added muscular help it might be a key. Baclofen goes right to Gaba so it should be a good choice but if your gonna be a zombie all the time - you trade one problem for another right?

Scientist know now that Sleep Apnea is brain damage, not being chubby or having restricted airways from enlarged tonsils etc. That finding gave us a break. The Cpap helps many and can save your life but it caused me more problems and I had to stop using it. I hope it works for you.

The sugar, any excess salt, the Cpap and hey try pure gaba with all of that.

I managed to walk out of a wheelchair so getting the right combination can really make things different.

Good luck, hugs, Hopabout

fibrokitty said:

Hi Hopabout,

Have you heard of the link between fibro and sleep apnea? I have severe sleep apnea and never reach REM sleep. So essentially all I get is nonrestorative sleep. I have a CPAP machine that I am attempting to get used to.

I will look for the pjs. I never heard of conductors of electricity causing pain. What is that connection?

AHHH the sugar thing. Now that is hard. I have been working on this for years and sometimes I am good and sometimes not so good. He He

Maria

Hopabout said:

I found out about something that made such sense. There are some pajamas, they are costly for sure but they have a material that stops ions from messing with you while you sleep. Even help with menopause I read. I think its called Goodnighties or something. Search Ion pajamas.

Now, I solved part of my problem with baby soft things. Nylon conducts electricity. Anything you wear with nylon on it, is going to cause you pain. All cotton, and baby soft, or at least thin flannel. If your skin is covered and nothing is sticking out while you sleep it does make a big difference.

We have a gene that keeps us from properly being in the hypnotic state as we sleep. I feel certain that its that condition that keeps us stiff when we wake. So far I can't find an answer to get around it, but I am searching daily. Some tips that have helped me are

Always wear something warm on your legs and feet. Do not eat any sugar products at all after dinner at night. Glucose does not metabolise when you don't get proper sleep. Stretch before you go to bed,and before you get up if you can do that before a trip to the bathroom. Don't allow A/c or fan to blow on you while you sleep, your nociceptors send bad vibes to the brain. Be sure you are taking a proper amount of Magnesium Malate - super important Fibro food. I take mine in the morning when I get up and about 9 at night... this helps me sleep better and wake up less tight.

Just some ideas. Its hard when you have to "tinkle" and can't move to get out of bed !

Hopabout

12

You are too funny! maybe moving to a mall is a bad idea--i would spend all my time shopping!

But I applaud your intellect and ability to understand science. You should be given an honorary biochem degree. I studied bio as an undergrad and slightly remember cations and anions. Then when training to be a physician assistant we learned about immunity and how negative charges help proteins cross into tissue. You give me much to ponder.

Again--thanks for the info
Hopabout said:

Hi Fibrokitty,

I forgot to answer you regarding the electricity.

I just study. At this point after 19 years of it and 600 Fibromyalgia study subjects in the past years, I understand this stuff pretty good. I have some 20 boxes of files and two computers full. I only study research, not ideas on line.

I don't have medical training like you or understand the technical data - just read, absorb, cut and paste... and put it all together. Something I seldom see doctors doing. Your being in nursing is one of the first signs of Fibro. There is a list of professions and hobbies.

We are mostly made of water. We have a few electrolites wandering around inside of us - chloride being one that is essential to Fibros. But mostly we are a huge tall mound of atoms. Protons and Electrons. And, the foods we eat and amino acids we consume also have a plus and minus end just like a battery. The only problem is our amino acids are out of sinc - out of line in the chain - some are reversed, some are missing, and some are doubled instead of one unit as they should be. Virus, Toxins, Radiation, Bacteria... the list goes on as to what is responsible for that.

Ions in the air are interesting things. They are atoms or molecules where the electrons are not equal fo the number of protons. That gives the electrical positive or negative charge. + - An anion gives more electrons than protons and are negative. A cation gives fewer electrons than protons and are positive.

The more Negatively Charged Electric Ions there are in the blood, the more efficient the cell's metabolism process.

But, the more positive ions the slower and less efficient the cell's metabolism; we get sick and age faster.

Malls put waterfalls in them because the negative ions coming from the fall will make the shoppers happier. When we feel bad, a longer than usual warm shower will help because the water has negative ions.

I read that negative ions cut down the serotonin levels and act like a natural transquilizer. I am very much aware of the wind and electrical activity in the air before a storm because it affects my moods. When you are exposed to high levels of negative atmosphere, serotonin appears in the urine disposing the excess. Negative ions affect melatonin greatly, which is our sleep hormone and is also synthesized from serotonin. "Quality sleep can also help reduce the occurrence of common pains such as backache, and increase your resistance to illness. A study of negative ions are known to help people sleep better by regulating the production of chemicals in the brain."

Barometric pressure is an enemy to us because of the positive ions in the clouds whirling in the upper atmosphere and because of the pressure on the veins and tissues in our bodies. " Rheumatoid arthritis, osteoarthritis, low back pain, gout, fibromyalgia, phantom limb pain, scar pain, headaches, trigeminal neuralgia, and pain influenced by mood disorders are all affected heavily. . Weather is also associated with changes in birth rates, sperm count, outbreaks of pneumonia, influenza and bronchial problems."

The idea behind the pajamas is to give us negative ions... the feeling of good mood while we sleep. I heard about them first on the ProHealth Website. Then did more research.

The object is to keep the air around us negative not positive. Bacteria, mold, etc. love positive air in which they thrive. So the moral of the story is, if your really sick and feel bad, go to the mall or find a water fall !

Ok, I am wordy.... so much for Baro- Ion 101.

Hopabout

13

I love to use Science Daily who sends you to the right people for the actual research but gives it in a summary easy to read. This will show you the Sleep Apnea study and it makes perfect sense. Thank you for your kind words, I am determined to find a way to fix us - the more I learn the closer I get.

Sleep Apnea Linked To Early Brain Damage

ScienceDaily (Nov. 21, 2002)

14

Hi Hopeabout,

Thanks for the link. Intersting article. One thing to be careful about is to check out the citations of a study. Are there any other studies that say the same. Also, the report does not say that it is only gray matter changes that cause sleep apnea, but it is another finding in ADDITION TO airway obstruction.

I still think the cpap machine sucks, however!

Maria

Hopabout said:

I love to use Science Daily who sends you to the right people for the actual research but gives it in a summary easy to read. This will show you the Sleep Apnea study and it makes perfect sense. Thank you for your kind words, I am determined to find a way to fix us - the more I learn the closer I get.

Sleep Apnea Linked To Early Brain Damage

ScienceDaily (Nov. 21, 2002)

15

fibrokitty, hi,

I am new to this site and there is so much information I am confused a bit.

I wanted to send you an email to tell you about something I read that is interesting and pertains to this discussion. But because it is a theory not a fact I do not wish to post it here. I can't find you on the members list and don't know how to send you the information I read privately. ? help

Thanks Hopabout/ Cheryl